Traveling Through Life & The World with Matt & Josh Of The Afters

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Transcription:

The Afters: Adoption is such a cool picture of the way God is with us. You know, he brings, he brings us, we have, we have no future and no hope, and he makes us his child, and he gives us everything that he has. And so, it’s like, you, you come from nothing and God, and we don’t deserve anything, and God gives us everything.

Sarah Taylor You guessed it. We have got The Afters. Well, you probably already saw that on the title of the podcast, but either way, Josh and Matt, both joined us today with this band that started when they both worked at Starbucks, and they would sing out the orders, and some customers said you guys should form a band. True story.

We begin our conversation because these guys are travel experts. And if you haven’t gotten to do a bunch of traveling for a while, we can live vicariously through them and their stories. Plus, they’re going to give you some great travel advice. Here’s Josh and Matt.

The Afters: Yeah, so we haven’t been able to do much international traveling and these last couple of years, but this year is changing. We did go, we filmed a music video last year in Belgium. That was international train. We went to Canada, went to Canada, but we have a lot of fun things coming up. We’re going to Australia in May. Doing a big event there with will Graham.

We’ll get to go to Tasmania, which will be really, really fun. And these are all, I mean, gospel centric events, which is really our heart’s passion. We love that. We’re going to Mongolia, going to Italy. Just doing big events in countries that have been really hurting and where the churches are, are really hurting and just hoping to encourage people and share the gospel in that way. But also, we’re going to get to experience some new cultures. So that’ll be exciting.

It’s really cool to go to a place like, you know, Milan or Paris where these big cities that have so much history. It’s just as cool to go to a place that’s just kind of off the beaten path. Like when we’re in Mongolia, I just, I’m so, you know, you know, you never plan a vacation to Mongolia. Right? So, it’s, I it’s so cool. I remember I’m watching a, watching a, it’s a, it’s a show called The Long Way Around, and it’s about these guys who ride their motorcycles around the world. And they go through, in order to get all the way around, they have to go through Siberia and over to Alaska and then come all the way back. They start in England, I think. And they they’re going through Mongolia. This is my only, it’s the only thing I know about Mongolia at this point, other than getting this grill. And they they’re going through Mongolia, and they don’t even know ’cause there, there haven’t been cartographers there that have actually made actual maps. So, they they’re like, we think there’s a road here and we think there’s a bridge across this river, but they don’t know until they actually get there. So, like to go to a place like that, that is so you know, undeveloped and just, there’s so much unknown still, even about imagine, which is probably where we will be. I can’t pronounce the name. I need, I’ll learn the pronunciation before we get go. But you get ready to drink yak milk because I hear that’s a big part of their diet is yak milk.

That’s an interesting thing about traveling and meeting families and people. There’s always a weird, the possibility for weird food. Oh yeah. When we were in Australia last time, we played a show that was in his town that was kind of out in the Bush. And there was a lot of the Aboriginal people there who were the native people from, from there. And they went out and hunted and shot kangaroo one night and photograph, I know a little kangaroo, but they, as, as an honor to us, they brought this kangaroo stew that was their family’s like long recipe. And they made this really great, like fluffy bread that goes along with it, that’s like their, their tribal bread, but they brought us this to stew, and of course we had to eat it. And it was really good. Yeah. We were surprised the picture of the dead king grew and I’m like, ah, I’m sorry. A little Kanga.

Sarah Taylor: First of all, you guys should have your own travel show. I’m sure you’ve talked about that.

The Afters: We have, yeah, it might be. Yeah. We, we do love that. We, we have started to, to a certain degree. Putting together, travel videos like that for our own YouTube channel. And we’ll see what happens with a few around the world with the after videos. And we might do some more that stuff.

Sarah Taylor: Okay. We’ll link to that in the show notes. I guess I’m curious for someone that’s listening and maybe they can’t travel as much as you do, would you share one of your takeaways? Like what do you bring back with you when you come back home to your place in the states? Like what perspective do you bring home with you having been everywhere in the world?

The Afters: Oh, that’s interesting. So, when I come home, I think that any, anytime you come back, just a wealth of experience, the world looks a little different. And so, when you see other places, I feel like I always come back in and I see the world just a little differently than I did before. And parts of it gave me more compassion for other people. It gives me gratitude for what I have, because a lot of times we go to places where people don’t have a lot. And if you don’t see that stuff, then you, there’s nothing to compare your life to. But you know, when we’ve gone to Africa and we went to Kali’s temple, which is the God of destruction there, the temple takes up a whole city block, with the exception of one little corner. And we, you walk in the temple gates and immediately, like the light switch went on and I thought, oh my gosh, this is what Jesus saw when he walked into the temple and saw the money changers and turned over the tables. There were literally just lined up, from the gates all the way, basically to the inner courts of the temple, just all of these people selling sacrifices. So, it’s like the poor people would just buy these little flowers and then the flowers get to like bigger flowers and then they get to like doves and then goats and then lambs.

So, it’s like the richer you are, the further in you go to buy your sacrifice and then you, you kind of wander around. This line goes kind of around the temple courts, and then you get to this little house, which is where they kill the animals. And then you walk through that little house through a trail of blood, into the house that they, that the idol is in. And it was just, it was it’s so changed kind of the way, like when I read those passages about, about the Bible. It’s, it’s hard to imagine that people are still like right now in 2022 are doing this they’re killing animals and throwing the bloody parts at this statue. And they’re praying so sincerely that they will be delivered from this illness, or that they’re whatever. You know, and it just, it blows my mind. It blows my mind and that changed me. The way that I read those passages, you can just see, you can see it. It’s not just like a story, you can, like when I read those passages, I just close my eyes and see like all of that.

No wonder Jesus was angry. Oh my gosh. Yeah, it was, it was the wildest thing. And then one of the most beautiful things about those same experiences we leave, we leave that place. And the one little corner that is not the temple, is Mother Theresa’s home for the sick and dying. And so, you leave this experience, which was just dark and oppressive, and just, you can feel it’s almost tangible, like the evil that exists in this one square block.

And then you walk out the gates and right next door, you see these, these selfless people caring for these dying people. And there’s no, there’s nothing that these people can give back. It’s not like they can pay for what they’re getting. I mean, they are literally loving the most unloved people in the world. In their last, in their last days and breaths. And it was such a beautiful picture of what the love of Jesus is like, compared to serving, serving a God that that can’t hear you and will give you nothing in return for everything that you give.

I would encourage anybody who’s thinking about traveling, because this is something that I’m super passionate about, I love seeing the world and I think that we, we, we change a lot when we do it. And if you’ve ever been intimidated by that and you think, oh, how am I going to do that? Or it’s too expensive. I can’t afford that. Just go for. Just go for it.

You’re going to see your life changing us here, and don’t be intimidated by the travel part. Embrace the, I always tell my family embrace the chaos because in travel, you never know what’s going to happen and you have to go off script. You have everything planned out and inevitably things are going to happen that, that change your trip, but usually those are the things that you end up remembering. I remember a trip that we took to Patagonia, my wife and I for our 20th anniversary. We always wanted to go down to Patagonia in south America. And ever since I had seen a picture from there it was 10 years before that or 15 years before that in the studio, and I said, that’s what we’re going for a 20-year anniversary. So, we did, and we had a layover in Santiago, Chile, and had all this plant stuff planned, but our plans were changed because Santiago was in the middle of a revolution. And so, we stayed in a little hotel there overnight. We had one night there, and I said, well, we got to see something. And the people at the hotel were like, yeah, you should probably stay at the hotel. And I was like, well, that’s boring. So, I said, is there any place we can go? So, they told us about a place on the outskirts. So, when did some hiking there and then we’re taking an Uber back to our hotel and we’re going through the city, we get stuck traffic and it’s just stand still. We’re not going anywhere. And so, I asked the guy, I said, well, What if we just kind of walked through the city to the other side, we bypass this traffic. Cause he said, this could take hours. And so, he said, well, you could, but there’s protests and stuff happening downtown.

Well, I was, I was kind of intrigued. And so, we got out and I said, and there’s a restaurant in the city center that I really want to try. It’s like supposed to be amazing. So, we start walking over and we start seeing like, all these crashed out windows and burned down bus stops. And the after me, you could tell something crazy happened here and there’s graffiti everywhere. And then we start seeing people marching, we start realizing, oh, everyone has gas masks on. And people had these war drums that they were, that they were hitting. And, and then we started, we, we turned on a street and we saw tanks, and we saw government people in full on with shields and all that stuff.

Riot gear. And I was like, Hmm, maybe we should not go this way. But it was so fascinating at the same time. I got some photos from it. But so we go, and we’re sitting there, and it was an amazing meal worth. Every bit of that detour. And we start hearing like some, some drums in the distance con con con con con, and I could tell the waiter, it was getting a little bit nervous. So I said, yeah, honey, I’m going to, we should, we should call an Uber and get back to the hotel. If she, if she recounted the story, it would be exactly the same.

And I’ll tell you why I’ll say this. So we just try. Yeah, exactly. This is not a glowing endorsement. But adventure happened. So, we, we end up. So, we, we go out we’re on the street and waiting for the Uber. And we start noticing this flood of people coming in with their with their drums and their flags. And they all had on gas masks, cause I guess the government was releasing tear gas. So Well, like why we got to get out of here.

We gotta go. Okay. So, the guy pulls up, we jumped in the car and he’s, “Get in. We’re gonna get stuck in the city.” Cause I guess when the protests start, they close off the edge of the city. So, we’re, we’re zooming away. We’re literally going over sidewalks and we see a giant pillar of tear gas and a crowd of a couple of hundred people running towards us as we’re going off. And on top of it, the soundtrack and the car was, metal covers a pop song. So, it was like this Norwegian metal band, you know, doing you know, hit me baby, one more time from a, you know, anyway. So, we get back to the hotel, like what just happened? I know it was not what we planned. And it might sound scary to a lot of people, and you don’t have to choose to go that far off script. We chose to do that. But it’s something that I’ll never forget. And it gave me a perspective on freedom. Like these are people like it made me care about their story. And like later I started following their story, and like, wow, this is actually a beautiful story of these people who are rising up. I would’ve never known about it, had we not seen that. And it just gave a whole different perspective. And we had, we had kids, we probably wouldn’t have done that, but no, we had kids, but they weren’t with

us. She, she was like, oh, but she, but she also valued that we experienced a part of history, but then so then we got on a plane, and we were in paradise and it was the most beautiful place we’d ever been in our lives. And it was, it was amazing.

Sarah Taylor: I don’t know if you’ve completely sold me, but I appreciate the effort.

The Afters: So, go join a revolution. No, don’t do that. No, but everywhere you go, you’re going to experience something beautiful. And, and if you go to Europe, for instance, like your kids are going to see things and remember things for the rest of their life, like it’ll inform who they become.

Sarah Taylor: All right. Well, that part I agree with. Okay. We’re pivoting now. It still involves like a destination far away, but you have such a powerful story, Josh, about your sister.

The Afters: Yeah. So, I have a sister named Jennifer. She always wanted to be Indiana Jones from the time she was a kid and saw those movies. She absolutely loved archeology. And so, she went to school for it, and graduated. When she graduated, she ended up moving to Israel and got a job working for one of the top archeologists in all biblical archeology. But he is an atheist, and his whole goal is to disprove the Bible. And so, he writes all these publications about how the Exodus didn’t happen, how Moses didn’t even exist.

Like he he’s basically deleting people from history. And then, you know, that Jesus was nothing more than, than a man who wanted to be a Messiah like so many other people did. And every he’s like every, every, every parent back then one of their kids to be the Messiah. He was the lucky one. His story got out. All these things.

And so, she started coming home and debating that with us and, and she lost her faith. She became an atheist. She really bought into it, and it just broke my parents hearts. And my dad in 2004, shortly before he passed away from cancer, he gave his Bible to my sister, which was his old worn-out Bible that had all of his notes and highlighted passages. And he said, yeah, I know this doesn’t mean anything to you, but I asked that you’d please keep it, and I pray that someday it does mean something to you. And she is putting on her bookshelf and it sat there for, for about 10 years. And then it was about 2013 that she was going through a really hard season with her family.

And she was having these dreams, really powerful, vivid dreams, where Jesus was a part of them. And I remember her telling me, Jesus is in my dreams, and I don’t like it. And I was like, maybe you should pay attention to those dreams. And so, she woke up one night from one of these dreams and couldn’t go back to sleep. So, she got up to get some water and walked through her living room and she saw that Bible on the bookshelf, and for the first time, since my dad gave it to her, she opened it up and she saw my dad’s notes, and there was a highlighted passes that just jumped off the page at her, and it spoke to directly what she was going through right then.

And for the next two nights, she kept going back to that Bible when she couldn’t sleep. And night after night, it was something that came alive, and it spoke to her. And she called me, it was the middle of the night, and she said, Josh, you’re gonna think I’m crazy but I think Jesus is pursuing me and I want to give my life to Jesus. And I prayed with her on the phone. Three months later, she flew out to Arizona where I live, and I got to baptize my sister. And then her husband, who is an Israeli Sabra Jew, which means his family goes way back, and they can trace their roots back to Aaron, they say so he, he became a Christian.

And so now he’s a messianic Jew. And last October, they moved their family back to Israel and they live right above the sea of Galilee, and they started a ministry reaching out to people in the archeology community, science community, Jewish community, to show that you can believe in history. And you can, you can believe in what we see in archeology and believe in Jesus.

And when you have Jesus that makes all those things come alive. And so, they’re just on fire and seeing that transformation, like if you had known my sister before you wouldn’t recognize her as the same person today. She’s a light came alive in her and she’s just on fire for Jesus. It’s really cool.

Sarah Taylor: Matt, what was it like for you to watch that unfold?

The Afters: Well, it’s interesting cause I’ve known Josh as, I mean, we grew up, we practically grew up together, and I’d only met Jennifer a couple of times, but we had spent, I had spent enough time with her too to kind of see both sides of that. And the, you know, transformation, true transformation is almost shocking when you see it, because it is, it’s, it’s 180 degrees, you know, turn around and it’s, it was a cool, it was a cool thing. And I mean, we’ve seen transformation in a lot of people. I remember I was working with a guy at Starbucks when we were back at Starbucks, and I just love, I just love, he was, he was one of these guys who was just the life of the party, super funny and just made everything so much fun. But he was just, you know, like just a party animal.

And I would talk to him about Jesus, and he was like, man, yeah, I know that’s the, you know, that’s what I should be doing, but I’m just having too much fun right now to really like slow down and think about that. And I prayed for him every day, for years and years and years. And long even, even a couple of years after I left Starbucks and he hadn’t even talked to him, he was still so heavy on my heart and I just prayed and prayed and, you know, slowly over time, prayed a little bit less and less and less. And I just reconnected with him after, my goodness, it had to have been about 18 years. And I found him on Instagram, and he reached out to me, and he said something.

And I thought, oh, I wonder what he’s doing. And I looked, so he was an alcoholic and he got completely sober married. This girl has a couple of beautiful kids, and they’re all believers in Jesus. And it’s that same transformation, you know, like to see his life go from where it was when I knew him, and all these years later, after years and years of praying for him and not knowing. You know, like, oh, I wonder whatever happened to Jesse. And then, you know, then, and then to see, so many years later, God answered my prayers, and it was just, it’s just amazing to see. The transformation is complete. And I talked to him a little bit about it, and he was like, yeah. You know, describing his life before, and describing his life now, I mean, you couldn’t, it doesn’t even seem like the same.

Sarah Taylor: Hmm. Thank you, guys, both for sharing, you know, I just hope that whoever’s listening right now, hears that story and is so encouraged to just keep praying for the one they love. I want to talk a little bit more about both of your upbringings, because they’re both so unique.

You’ve both touched on it a little bit. Matt let’s start with you, because I know that foster care and adoption is a big part of your story.

The Afters: So, I’m the oldest of eight, and my two, the two youngest brothers are adopted and they are, they’re just one and two and a half years older than my own, my oldest. So, sometimes, I mean, they are my brothers, but sometimes they feel almost like nephews, and not so much now that they’re getting older and kind of moving into adulthood, they are beginning to feel more like brothers and less like, like nephews, you know?

So, there’s twins in my family and they are the youngest blood relation to me. And after the twins were born and had kind of moved through infancy, I guess my mom was just not done. You know, like, she’s just, she’s such a, she’s such a mother and she’s like, I need, I need more babies in this house.

So, they decided they were going to foster kids. And they, they in all, in all they fostered eight or nine, I can’t remember, but it’s somewhere right about there. And the first one that they fostered, they ended up adopting. That’s my brother, Isaiah. And then the last one that they fostered, who is Isaiah’s half-brother, they also adopted. So, and at that point, the state said, oh, well you have too many, you have too many kids living in your house to foster children anymore. So, they, they had to give up fostering to adopt my two brothers. It was, it was, it was all worth it.

Anybody who has fostered children or adopted kids know that you kind of never know what you’re going to get, you know, and you’re, you’re adopting not just like this beautiful child, but some of their history and some of their DNA. And even and even though we were talking to someone about this the, you know, nature versus nurture thing… nature is strong. And it’s really, it’s, it can be really hard to undo sometimes. And we walked with my with my adopted brothers through all kinds of things. And even now it’s, it’s very difficult. One of them has a chemical imbalance, and so he if he’s not, if he’s not really good about staying on his medication, he, I mean, he’s been brought home by the police many times. Cause he’ll get manic. I’m not sure if he even remembers what, where he’s been and what he’s done when he gets in these places, because it’s just so, it’s, it’s, it’s a crazy, it’s a crazy thing, but God has really done some amazing things in, in their hearts. And I look forward to seeing what, what he does with them. One of my, the older of the two who if I remember sometimes, I get cause there were so many issues that they both had and they were simultaneous.

I think he was a kleptomaniac. Like he would just take things which was really hard to deal with. But after, you know, kind of walking through that with him, you know, my dad is such a great shepherd, and he’s such a godly man. He, the, my brother now is in seminary. He’s going to be a pastor and he’s currently a youth pastor at a church in Dallas and he is working his way through seminary. And it’s just so cool to see what God has done in his, in his life, in his heart. You know, his mom was basically living on the street, and you know, what, what would his future have looked like? You know, I have no idea. Adoption is such a cool picture of the way God is with us. You know, he brings, he brings us. We have, we have no future and no hope, and he makes us his child.

And he gives us everything that he has. And so, it’s like, you, you come from nothing, and God, and we don’t deserve anything, and God gives us everything. And it was like, you know, these boys, their adoption was just the same picture. They, they had, they had nothing and their life would have just been destitution and you know, they would have grown up fatherless and homeless and they, they were actually given just a beautiful family and people that love them and care for them, and who’ve helped them become, become something that will, that will build God’s kingdom. And it’s just a, it’s a beautiful picture. And we’re, we’re all the same way. If we think about it long enough.

Sarah Taylor: You both really get to witness a lot of transformation. Josh, we already talked about one of your sisters and then of course there’s Esther, who’s just a traveling photographer, has a story all of her own. And then one of your brothers has a story as well.

The Afters: Yeah. Yeah. We’ve seen a lot of God transformation, and you know, I, I credit a lot of that to, we had parents who really prayed over every aspect of our lives. My mom she recently found this Bible that had all these old prayers. And I remember my mom just praying and praying for her kids, even in the hard seasons. And so, when my brother was on meth, he went through a really difficult season of life where he was addicted to meth for about 10 years and lost everything. Even lost his kid. Child protective services took his kid. He didn’t want help. Anytime somebody tried to reach out cause it happened again and again, and people would try to reach out and help him. And I mean, there was, it was so bad that there was a night I remember, where he called me and he needed money for, for more drugs. I knew it was from more drugs, and I wasn’t going to help him and give him money. And he, he was going to come over and kill me, like he was threatening my life.

And so, I was done. I was like, oh, you’re, you’re just a lost cause. You everybody’s trying to help you. You’re getting handouts and, and you, you don’t want to help. And so, I was totally done. And my mom was the one who came to me. She says, Josh, we can’t, can’t give up on him. God’s going to change him. We got to believe that. And you you’ve gotta, you’ve gotta, still love him. You don’t enable him but love him and believe and pray that God’s going to change him. And so, I committed with her to pray for him, and it wasn’t overnight, you know, a lot of times there’s a waiting season when we pray, but he did get to that place where God broke him down, and he ended up serving time. But it was in that place that he realized I need Jesus. And so when he got out, he checked himself into a rehab. He’s not been cleaned for like 15 years and has a beautiful family and has his life back on track. He loves Jesus. Yeah. So that was really cool to see. And yeah, it’s, our family is definitely proof of the transformation that can happen in people’s lives.

Sarah Taylor: And I hear you both just giving so much of the credit to your moms and your dads, and those powerful prayers prayed in the middle of the night. Let’s pivot to the fact that both of you have your families of your own, right? Interestingly enough, you both have 18-year-olds that are like getting ready to launch this year.

The Afters: Surreal. Like, I feel like I’m not, I don’t know. Do you feel this? Sometimes? I feel like even though I’m, I’m 41 now, but I, some ways I feel like I’m still 25, like how. How am I 41? See my, how do I have an 18-year-old?

Nope, I do. I empathize with that. Although my back and knee remind me that I actually am. Yes. That I am not 25 anymore. No, it’s interesting. I would say that now, you know, my daughter does not feel like an adult, even though my age, she is. No, you know, but talking, talking about, like you just, you were talking about like these, the parents who, you know, prayed for prayed for us. And I, I mean, all of those prayers have come true for my, like the prayer, the prayers that my parents prayed that their kids would love Jesus and serve him, have all come true.

And my dad was talking to, my grandfather passed away probably four or five years ago, and I was talking to my dad about it, cause I got to spend some time with my grandpa too, in the hospital before he died. And I was talking to my dad about it one day and he said I was talking to your grandpa, and you know, he prayed for everyone in the family, all of his kids and their spouses and their kids and their kids. Cause he was a great grandpa when he died. And every single one of them by name every single day. And he said, and I, you know, I, I was talking to, you know, my grandpa, his dad about it. And he said, so I started doing that.

He’s like, I started, I started praying for all of you kids and you know, all of your kids, and all of that on his way to work on his commute. And I started thinking about that and realized that I I’ve missed a lot of opportunities to pray for my own kids and pray with them, pray for them and with them. And you know, prayer has always been a hard thing for me. I’m a real ATD, so my mind tends to wander and I think I just give up too easily. And so, this year I committed. I was like, I don’t, I should not wait until my dad dies to cover my family on prayer. And so, I committed this year, I realized that one of the things, yeah. I mean, there’s, there’s only so much you can do about your dad. Okay. But I’m going to power through that. But the other thing, but the other thing that I realized was a real detriment to my prayer life, is my phone. Because once I picked that up, it’s like, I can’t put it down for the rest of the day.

And it’s, it’s whether it’s email or social media or texting, or I know I’m running a business with Josh, and so there’s lots of all of that back and forth, you know? And it’s like, once I pick up my phone, the day just disappears. And so, I just committed to not pick up my phone until I’ve prayed for everybody that I need to pray for. Which sometimes makes me difficult to get ahold of before, you know, 10:00 AM. But because if I get distracted, And go off on a rabbit trail and life starts to happen as the day goes on, I’m like, Nope, I’m going to, I’ve got to finish praying for all of my people before I, you know, before I picked that thing up and it sucks me in.

Matt, since you shared that with me, that you were doing that, I started doing the same thing. And it gets your whole, your mind in a completely different place. Even like, for the rest of the day, I feel like. I feel like I’m in a better place when I start off praying for like, like you were sharing. You start with my wife, and I go through the whole family and intentionally pray for each of them. And you have stuff that’s pressing on the phone. Right. You have things you have to get back to emails. You know that thing is digging right there.

It’s amazing how much you can make time for prayer when you say I’m not going to get on my phone. It’s like, it’s a great strategy. I love that. And otherwise, at the end of the day, you’ll look back and oh, if you, if you look at your screen time, are you, well, I have plenty of time for Instagram. It’s time for all these other things. Yeah. Why don’t I spend time with her, but now if you, if you can’t get ahold of Matt in the morning, you know, that he just hasn’t prayed yet.

Convicting. I love that though.

Sarah Taylor: Oh, you guys did so good. I’m right there with you. I’m going to make a renewed effort because even as you’re talking, I’m thinking about how my mother, she, all the notes in her Bible are written. I’m here as a result of her prayer.

The Afters: Yes. I’ve started writing down prayers because when, when we found that old Bible from my mom that had all these prayers, I mean, this is from when I was in high school, every single one of the prayers, even the most random little details. Like she lives in a cabin in the woods now, and she, she saw on that prayer list, I pray that someday I will live in a cabin in the woods. And she has two dogs and she prayed that someday she would have two dogs. So it was very specific. And she said, I never would have given God credit for all these things that happened in my life because I’ve totally forgotten. But God answered all these prayers. For kids, for the family. Yeah. And it took time. I mean, praying is not a genie bottle, you know. It’s not like you pray and it happens like God’s, God’s timing is not always the timing that we would love, but it’s, it’s the best timing and it could take time and there’s, there’s seasons of waiting. But every, every time when you look at, when you look back, you’ll see the faithfulness of God and that, and that’s, that’s where our family seen

Sarah Taylor: Josh and Matt from The Afters, it’s always such a pleasure to get to hear from them. And thank you to Kai Elmer with Fair Trade for bringing them along and for setting up this interview. Always a thank you, huge shout out to Scott Karow, our wonderful producer with Terra Firma. And to Rebecca Beckett, our content coordinator with onpurposely.com.

Thank you also, if you’ve rated us left a review. I have one here from Matt. He said, I lost my job unexpectedly this year, and I’ve been spending a lot of time asking God to guide me to work I love and have a passion for. The stories shared on this podcast have been such an encouragement and companion for me during this season of my life.

So, thank you, Matt. And I wish you all the best. I’m sure that you are going to land exactly where you are supposed to be. You are welcome to also leave a review, and thank you so much for listening to the Passion Meets Purpose podcast. My name is Sarah Taylor, and I will see you in two weeks.

Special thanks to Northwest University for sponsoring the Passion Meets Purpose Podcast. NU is a faith-based and Christ-centered community, offering undergraduate and graduate programs in person and online. At Northwest University, your future isn’t canceled, it’s just beginning.